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El Norte · Senior Member

List coming out

Noice · Senior Member

This is very simple. If there is a curve or scaling , it must be applied PRIOR to seniority, medals, jst, etc. If they sent the list to the job to apply bonus points then this will be it. The curve has to applied to your final raw score after throwouts. If i get a 75 but i have 3 bonus points, Im going to get less of a curve than a 75 with 2.5 bonus points, and the bonus points will actually be a negative, so im feeling this is may be the whole list.

That being said, it doesnt make sense for the captain list to be 500 and the lt to be 850. Theoretically, 850 is about 4 years of promotions, but with a near 500 person captain list, and a 4400 person sgt list, I anticipated this list to be 1500+. 850 is an outlier so we will see.

Tunit · Senior Member

Correct me if I am wrong then, but there have been a few people with PA hooks that have reported back with their new score. None of those scores picked up as many points as they would have with this .231 scale thats been used lately. So if there was a curve already applied to this PA list, it wasnt at a .231 scale.

El Norte · Senior Member

Why send a list of 850? This is the big question what was the criteria for this. Were assuming that this was sent by DCAS but could this be what the job came up with already?

El Norte · Senior Member

Tunit wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong then, but there have been a few people with PA hooks that have reported back with their new score. None of those scores picked up as many points as they would have with this .231 scale thats been used lately. So if there was a curve already applied to this PA list, it wasnt at a .231 scale.

With their new score are any of them under 70? Just wandering because its really messing up my head not knowing if I need those extra few points to be on this list those fortunate ones have seen.

pposgt · Member

I don't think there will be a curve. Why would DCAS send over a list to get seniority/medals/jst points added, just to have the list sent back and put a curve on it, then go through a whole other round of adding points in for newly passed people.

Tunit · Senior Member

Because if DCAS sent the PA a list of anyone sitting at 61 and above after the throwouts/double answers (which is what I heard is the lowest number from the PA list), then those people will be at a 70 once they apply the .231 curve. A 61 becomes a 70.009 raw score. JST/medal points can then be added to that.

TenFour16 · Guru

Crazy how you guys make things up in your heads. A list of X amount (the number in your head) was NOT. SENT. ANYWHERE. A list of ALL EXAM takers was generated.

ALL 2400+. That list had scores. From there, the job applies the necessary points.

NO LIST was sent leaving out ANYONE.

People are making shit up in their heads. The 850 number is:

1. Made up

Or

2. An estimate from those who saw the FULL list and counted what they thought the curve would start from.

There is no 850 person list.

-- Edited by TenFour16 on Sunday 19th of November 2023 02:01:50 PM

TenFour16 · Guru

It doesnt matter what makes sense in your head or not. What I posted is a fact that I will not give info on (like MANY ON HERE) because people dont want to give up their sources.

That is a FACT.

Now what the job does after, i dont know. How and what they do with it. I dont know.

TenFour16 · Guru

The reason you guys are hearing about a score in the 40s is because 1 actual person, who KNEW THEY FAILED AND HAD NO CHANCE, called their connect out of curiosity to get their score, and they shared it.

How were they able to get their score ?

Because of what I just said. Using the list with EVERYONES SCORE.

You guys cannot fathom that ALL of the scores you are hearing of are within curve range. This is why you are not hearing ridiculous scores like 30s, 40s los 50s etc.

The obvious reason is because the people who failed miserably are not bothering to make those calls. They know they failed, so they arent calling connects to get their scores. This should have been obvious from the day this info blew up.

For christs sake i thought we were cops.

-- Edited by TenFour16 on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:08:42 PM

No1isbetter · Guru

1. If this list contained all Exam-Applicants , then theyre applying the Points & assessing a Curve that fits Dept needs.

2. If this list is actually in the 850+ range than thats it.

A lot of contradicting stories. One person says the lowest score they saw on that list was 61, another one says the list contained all 2400. Who actually saw the fucking list? This is all a joke. Everyone wants clout for being the first, line news media, rather get the story out then get the story right.

NauseousPBBN · Senior Member

This is how the list works:

Theres an original list with raw scores
(Currently rumored to be 275-375 passing grades)

DCAS processes the protested questions, then creates an updated list with throwouts/double and triple answers creating the list currently at academy
(Currently rumored to have 850ish passing grades)

The job goes through the whole list provided by DCAS and documents what JST/medals need to be applied. The job then returns this information to DCAS

DCAS will then formulate a final list and apply the curve (IF they use a curve which seems most likely)

Now this is the part of most confusion. IF a curve is applied, it will apply to everyone who reached a 61 on the updated list sent to academy. Thus increasing the list to 1000+.

I know some people are getting caught up on jst/medals but the job doesnt apply points, they merely inform DCAS of the bonus points. The curve can be applied either way regardless. You can DM me if you need help understanding.

yankeefanhatebsox · Senior Member

NauseousPBBN wrote:
This is how the list works:

Theres an original list with raw scores
(Currently rumored to be 275-375 passing grades)

DCAS processes the protested questions, then creates an updated list with throwouts/double and triple answers creating the list currently at academy
(Currently rumored to have 850ish passing grades)

The job goes through the whole list provided by DCAS and documents what JST/medals need to be applied. The job then returns this information to DCAS

DCAS will then formulate a final list and apply the curve (IF they use a curve which seems most likely)

Now this is the part of most confusion. IF a curve is applied, it will apply to everyone who reached a 61 on the updated list sent to academy. Thus increasing the list to 1000+.

I know some people are getting caught up on jst/medals but the job doesnt apply points, they merely inform DCAS of the bonus points. The curve can be applied either way regardless. You can DM me if you need help understanding.

This has been explained 100000 times guys dont get it. The math is what it is, if the curve equation is what is being rumored then it does not matter if you do not end Up with a 61 after throwouts and double answers. If after you for your score off of this list you are not at a 61 then chances are you will not be on the list.

El Norte · Senior Member

Okay now I see how this 850 can be possible, the number is still legit so they could be counting 61 and up thus making the number still 850 which pretty much guarantees it all being made. All these Gloom and Doom of not classes going in to academy will get fixed eventually. Anyone with a little time on the job knows this even if they have to crank out huge classes down the line. If the # will be 850ish is still good news everyone gets made an a new test down the road.

Taketheday · Guru

yankeefanhatebsox wrote:
NauseousPBBN wrote:
This is how the list works:

Theres an original list with raw scores
(Currently rumored to be 275-375 passing grades)

DCAS processes the protested questions, then creates an updated list with throwouts/double and triple answers creating the list currently at academy
(Currently rumored to have 850ish passing grades)

The job goes through the whole list provided by DCAS and documents what JST/medals need to be applied. The job then returns this information to DCAS

DCAS will then formulate a final list and apply the curve (IF they use a curve which seems most likely)

Now this is the part of most confusion. IF a curve is applied, it will apply to everyone who reached a 61 on the updated list sent to academy. Thus increasing the list to 1000+.

I know some people are getting caught up on jst/medals but the job doesnt apply points, they merely inform DCAS of the bonus points. The curve can be applied either way regardless. You can DM me if you need help understanding.
This has been explained 100000 times guys dont get it. The math is what it is, if the curve equation is what is being rumored then it does not matter if you do not end Up with a 61 after throwouts and double answers. If after you for your score off of this list you are not at a 61 then chances are you will not be on the list.

This is correct. Let me clarify as well the 850 number that I have been commenting on is the amount of people currently at 70 right now after Throwouts/Double Answers. The actual list I saw had everyone who took the exam on it however my source had arranged it to show all who currently passed hence the 850. I did see people with scores such as 50s 40s ectt. who were NOT part or that 850 count. Idk if it will be curved or not I would assume it would since the last 3 exams were but noone will really know until it drops which I was told was supposed to be end of Month. Hope that clears this up for all those wondering sorry for the confusion. And again based on the entire list of Test Takersonly about 850 people have a passing score of 70 RIGHT NOW,

as stated before if there were a curve added then someone with say a 65,69 would most likely make the list.

El Norte · Senior Member

Taketheday wrote:
yankeefanhatebsox wrote:
NauseousPBBN wrote:
This is how the list works:

Theres an original list with raw scores
(Currently rumored to be 275-375 passing grades)

DCAS processes the protested questions, then creates an updated list with throwouts/double and triple answers creating the list currently at academy
(Currently rumored to have 850ish passing grades)

The job goes through the whole list provided by DCAS and documents what JST/medals need to be applied. The job then returns this information to DCAS

DCAS will then formulate a final list and apply the curve (IF they use a curve which seems most likely)

Now this is the part of most confusion. IF a curve is applied, it will apply to everyone who reached a 61 on the updated list sent to academy. Thus increasing the list to 1000+.

I know some people are getting caught up on jst/medals but the job doesnt apply points, they merely inform DCAS of the bonus points. The curve can be applied either way regardless. You can DM me if you need help understanding.
This has been explained 100000 times guys dont get it. The math is what it is, if the curve equation is what is being rumored then it does not matter if you do not end Up with a 61 after throwouts and double answers. If after you for your score off of this list you are not at a 61 then chances are you will not be on the list.
This is correct. Let me clarify as well the 850 number that I have been commenting on is the amount of people currently at 70 right now after Throwouts/Double Answers. The actual list I saw had everyone who took the exam on it however my source had arranged it to show all who currently passed hence the 850. I did see people with scores such as 50s 40s ectt. who were NOT part or that 850 count. Idk if it will be curved or not I would assume it would since the last 3 exams were but noone will really know until it drops which I was told was supposed to be end of Month. Hope that clears this up for all those wondering sorry for the confusion. And again based on the entire list of Test Takersonly about 850 people have a passing score of 70 RIGHT NOW,
as stated before if there were a curve added then someone with say a 65,69 would most likely make the list.

Thank you for this, it clarifies this a heck of a lot more. not trying to start a war here just simple curiosity because it seems now that these throw outs will be the ultimate determining factor For placement whats the average people are picking up and which session?

63_sniffer · Senior Member

Sooooooo. The list is 850?

Beta86 · Veteran Member

63_sniffer wrote:
Sooooooo. The list is 850?

But when DCAS applies the curve probably going to be a bigger list, maybe 1600

35amonth · Senior Member

I picked someone brain in personnel yesterday and here you go. Do what you may with this information.

1- DCAS has applied the adjusted score that only includes throw-outs.
2- The entire list of test takers is on a spreadsheet with 885 candidates above a 70. (Filtered on excel by scores)
3- The NYPD has been tasked with adding seniority, medals, and JST to ALL test takers and send it back to DCAS
4- DCAS will apply the curve and add the seniority, medals, and JST to those with a curved score of 70 and above. (Candidates with less than a 70 will not receive any of the aforementioned adjustments sent to DCAS by the NYPD in step 3)
5- DCAS will publish the list once the final adjustments are made.

We are currently in step 3. End of the month sounds about right.

-- Edited by 35amonth on Sunday 19th of November 2023 04:54:00 PM

35amonth · Senior Member

To clarify for Step 3- there is an aggregate function for lines on excel (each row will have the sum or the point adjustments like seniority, JST, and medals, when added will give you an adjusted score). So if the job adds points, the aggregate will only be applied by DCAS for those with 70 plus- fairly simple task for DCAS On excel.

-- Edited by 35amonth on Sunday 19th of November 2023 04:57:36 PM

35amonth · Senior Member

Example:

Mike got a 66 on test day. Picked up 3 throw outs and is at a 69. The NYPD adds his seniority (2), JST (1), and medals (.5). Mike is now at a 72.5 in step 3. The job sends his seniority, JST, and medals to DCAS- his adjusted score will be curved at his raw score of 66 and list will be in the high 70s. Adding him as another person to the 885 list.

Jill- got a 59 on test day. She picked up 1 throw out, putting her at a 60. The NYPD adds her seniority (5), JST (1), and medals (.5). Jill is now at a 66.5 in step 3. In step 4 DCAS applies the curve with Jills 60, putting her at a 69. She will not receive the 6.5 points the NYPD adjusted and not make the list.

-- Edited by 35amonth on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:10:47 PM

TenFour16 · Guru

35amonth wrote:
Example:

Mike got a 66 on test day. Picked up 3 throw outs and is at a 69. The NYPD adds his seniority (2), JST (1), and medals (.5). Mike is now at a 72.5 in step 3. The job sends his seniority, JST, and medals to DCAS- his adjusted score will be curved at his raw score of 66 and list will be in the high 70s. Adding him as another person to the 885 list.

Jill- got a 59 on test day. She picked up 1 throw out, putting her at a 60. The NYPD adds her seniority (5), JST (1), and medals (.5). Jill is now at a 66.5 in step 3. In step 4 DCAS applies the curve with Jills 60, putting her at a 69. She will not receive the 6.5 points the NYPD adjusted and not make the list.

-- Edited by 35amonth on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:10:47 PM

In the first example, this means Mike is on the list of 885 people even though he ended up with a 69 after throwouts.

wouldnt that mean the 885 list is WITH curve ?

35amonth · Senior Member

TenFour16 wrote:
35amonth wrote:
Example:

Mike got a 66 on test day. Picked up 3 throw outs and is at a 69. The NYPD adds his seniority (2), JST (1), and medals (.5). Mike is now at a 72.5 in step 3. The job sends his seniority, JST, and medals to DCAS- his adjusted score will be curved at his raw score of 66 and list will be in the high 70s. Adding him as another person to the 885 list.

Jill- got a 59 on test day. She picked up 1 throw out, putting her at a 60. The NYPD adds her seniority (5), JST (1), and medals (.5). Jill is now at a 66.5 in step 3. In step 4 DCAS applies the curve with Jills 60, putting her at a 69. She will not receive the 6.5 points the NYPD adjusted and not make the list.

-- Edited by 35amonth on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:10:47 PM
In the first example, this means Mike is on the list of 885 people even though he ended up with a 69 after throwouts.
wouldnt that mean the 885 list is WITH curve ?

No- curve has not been applied yet. Only throwouts. He will be #886

35amonth · Senior Member

The current list has him as a 69. The published list will reflect high 70s

-- Edited by 35amonth on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:24:54 PM

Aperez610 · Member

It's fairly simply. Not sure why we're still debating this. This has been accurate for pretty much every test since the 2016 Sergeant's test without fail. Take the raw score of someone on any of the tests (raw score including throwouts), add .231 for every question they got wrong, and any additional points (medals + seniority + JST), you will get their final score.

The exams are scaled. For every question you get wrong, you get .231 of a point.

61 raw score = 61 correct points + (39 incorrect x 0.231= 9.009 additional points) = minimum passing score to get you over a 70.

61+9.009 = 70.009

If your raw score is a 61, with the scaled score, you are at a 70.09 which is passing. The list floating around is all raw scores with throw outs.

If you have a raw score of 61 after throwouts, then you will get the .231 for every question wrong, plus seniority, plus medals, plus JST. It doesn't matter if the scaled points are added after or before JST/seniority because the equation doesn't change.

Raw Score (61 and up after throw outs) + .231 of point (x incorrect) + medals + seniority + JST = Total Score

-- Edited by Aperez610 on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:39:34 PM

35amonth · Senior Member

Aperez610 wrote:
It's fairly simply. Not sure why we're still debating this. This has been accurate for pretty much every test since the 2016 Sergeant's test without fail. Take the raw score of someone on any of the tests (raw score including throwouts), add .231 for every question they got wrong, and any additional points (medals + seniority + JST), you will get their final score.

The exams are scaled. For every question you get wrong, you get .231 of a point.

61 raw score = 61 correct points + (39 incorrect x 0.231= 9.009 additional points) = minimum passing score to get you over a 70.

61+9.009 = 70.009

If your raw score is a 61, with the scaled score, you are at a 70.09 which is passing. The list floating around is all raw scores with throw outs.

If you have a raw score of 61 after throwouts, then you will get the .231 for every question wrong, plus seniority, plus medals, plus JST. It doesn't matter if the scaled points are added after or before JST/seniority because the equation doesn't change.

Raw Score (61 and up after throw outs) + .231 of point (x incorrect) + medals + seniority + JST = Total Score

-- Edited by Aperez610 on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:39:34 PM

yes! This

get your score on the current list of 885 and add .231 to each question you got wrong. This will get you a curved score. Then add the 3 adjustments to it.

Bikelife · Member

How do you know for sure .231 is guaranteed for every wrong answer?

35amonth · Senior Member

So that is honestly the only variable. The curve is designed to account for inequities. Things like difficulty, race, gender, time of day of test, age, experience etc. the science is not clean. We just go based on the patterns set on the previous CAPT, Sgts exam.

El Norte · Senior Member

Aperez610 wrote:
It's fairly simply. Not sure why we're still debating this. This has been accurate for pretty much every test since the 2016 Sergeant's test without fail. Take the raw score of someone on any of the tests (raw score including throwouts), add .231 for every question they got wrong, and any additional points (medals + seniority + JST), you will get their final score.

The exams are scaled. For every question you get wrong, you get .231 of a point.

61 raw score = 61 correct points + (39 incorrect x 0.231= 9.009 additional points) = minimum passing score to get you over a 70.

61+9.009 = 70.009

If your raw score is a 61, with the scaled score, you are at a 70.09 which is passing. The list floating around is all raw scores with throw outs.

If you have a raw score of 61 after throwouts, then you will get the .231 for every question wrong, plus seniority, plus medals, plus JST. It doesn't matter if the scaled points are added after or before JST/seniority because the equation doesn't change.

Raw Score (61 and up after throw outs) + .231 of point (x incorrect) + medals + seniority + JST = Total Score

-- Edited by Aperez610 on Sunday 19th of November 2023 05:39:34 PM

I apologize because you actually explained it very well, but I just want to make sure Im getting this correctly, the curve will be applied to my raw score not adjusted score after throw outs correct?

35amonth · Senior Member

Raw score is what you have on this list floating around.

Aperez610 · Member

The easy answer is its been implemented on every exam since NYC hired an outside company to review their exams back in 2015/2016. If you really want to dig deep, you can search nyc.gov for the report somewhere. I read it a while back but it is literally a pain in the ass to find.

The likelihood of the .231 not being implemented here is minimal. Its been used on every other exam to the same exact accounting of .231 for every incorrect answer. There is no logical reason why it won't be applied here.

Aperez610 · Member

No, the curve gets added to your adjusted raw score (including throwouts).

If you scored a 61 but picked up 3 throwouts and have a final raw score of 64, you will get .231 for 36 incorrect questions. 36*.231= 8.316 additional points, giving you a final score of 72.316 + seniority + medals + JST for your total score.

El Norte · Senior Member

35amonth wrote:
Raw score is what you have on this list floating around.

Thats why I was asking I know my raw score test date, no idea as far as the list floating around I can only calculate based on this number and .231 curve, hence why I was interested in knowing if it was that score from test date for the curve of this other number some got to see l.

El Norte · Senior Member

Aperez610 wrote:
No, the curve gets added to your adjusted raw score (including throwouts).
If you scored a 61 but picked up 3 throwouts and have a final raw score of 64, you will get .231 for 36 incorrect questions. 36*.231= 8.316 additional points, giving you a final score of 72.316 + seniority + medals + JST for your total score.

This conflicts with the example

El Norte · Senior Member

El Norte wrote:
Aperez610 wrote:
No, the curve gets added to your adjusted raw score (including throwouts).
If you scored a 61 but picked up 3 throwouts and have a final raw score of 64, you will get .231 for 36 incorrect questions. 36*.231= 8.316 additional points, giving you a final score of 72.316 + seniority + medals + JST for your total score.
This conflicts with the example

Example said raw you after throw outs

BobbyBocs · Member

I dont know what youre not getting. If you got a 61 or better after throw outs / double answers,
You will be on the list. Dont make me tell Tony, capeesh?

63_sniffer · Senior Member

Come on Christmas classssssss. Lets gooooo

Joe2020 · Member

Whats the vacancies so far?

HopeBoss · Senior Member

Wheres yalls list ?

A10shun · Senior Member

I understand this curve has been used plenty of times. Whose to say they use it now? Its there discretion

DRPapi1983 · Guru

Exam will be curved. Just like the Captains and Sergeants list. Very soon it will get published.

-- Edited by DRPapi1983 on Monday 20th of November 2023 05:35:34 AM

Futureauxiliary · Guru

New week, hopefully we can get more info.

TenFour16 · Guru

Lets get this started. Hearing rumblings that final list is over 1200.

Anyone else ?

35amonth · Senior Member

Honestly we can get an exact number by accounting for anyone over a 61 on the list thats circulating.

35amonth · Senior Member

Whoever has access to this list- simple question- How many people scored 61 or better on the current list?

NauseousPBBN · Senior Member

List is circulating? I havent even got my score yet lol

Member nypd · Member

Check Personnel bureau, promotional list folder. Maybe they put it out.

TenFour16 · Guru

35amonth wrote:
Whoever has access to this list- simple question- How many people scored 61 or better on the current list?

Most important question on the forum.

Kawasakicop · Member

I heard the same form a person who stated that they want the list to be 1200. Currently out of all the people on the list after throw outs ,,853 have a score of 70 and above.

yankeefanhatebsox · Senior Member

TenFour16 wrote:
Lets get this started. Hearing rumblings that final list is over 1200.

Anyone else ?

Just heard 1300ish and Monday.prayers man