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Post Info TOPIC: Yet another article on this whole debacle! hot off the presses (from the Chief)


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Yet another article on this whole debacle! hot off the presses (from the Chief)


http://thechiefleader.com/news/news_of_the_week/lieut-test-cheating-suspicion-put-hold-on-nypd-promotions/article_a6915b3a-f500-11e5-976a-5bacb84f88d0.html

Lieut. Test Cheating Suspicion Put Hold On NYPD Promotions

By MARK TOOR 33 min ago 0

Concerned about possible cheating on the most recent Lieutenants exam, the
NYPD and attorneys for nine Ser­geants who challenged the fairness of the
test agreed to put promotions from the resulting list on hold, one of the
attorneys said last week.

Originally Set March 29

The first promotions off the 204-name list were scheduled for March 29 but
delayed by mutual agreement, said Randolph M. McLaughlin, a civil-rights
lawyer with the firm of Newman Ferrara who is representing the Sergeants.
The court turned the agreement into an order, he said.

Short 50 Lieutenants

Theyre short 50 Lieutenants now, Mr. McLaughlin said in an interview.
Theyve got to promote somebody. But I dont think the department wants to
promote people because they cheated.

You dont want to see people promoted who cheated, agreed Eugene ODonnell,
a former police officer and prosecutor who now teaches at the John Jay
College of Criminal Justice. It makes a mockery of the whole system. People
would look at a Lieutenant and wonder whether he or she is a real Lieutenant
or cheated on the exam.

The allegations arose after fewer than 7 percent of the 2,401 test-takers
passed the initial exam April 18, 2015, but 48 percent out of 80 passed the
makeup test given June 22 for those who were sick, had religious commitments
or were on military duty.

The NYPD apparently considers the wide variation in the passing rates to be
evidence that people who took the first test had passed the questions and
answers to those who took the makeup test. An Internet message board run by
Rising Star Promotions, a school for officers taking promotion tests,
contained one posting with a photo of the answer key and others offering
information on questions.

Union: Not Really Cheating

Union officials declined to characterize what happened as cheating. They and
the proprietors of Rising Star compared the postings with the pre-Internet
practice of discussing questions and answers in locker rooms and bars.

Mr. McLaughlin disagreed, saying, Its one thing for there to be an
allegation that people are talking. Its another thing for a test-taker to
take a picture of an answer key and post it on the Web.

Its not like 20 years ago, when I would have talked to two or three guys
in the command, Louis Turco, president of the Lieutenants Bene­vo­lent
Association, said in an interview. Social media has changed the whole
dynamic.

But Ed Carrasco, a partner in Rising Star and a Deputy Inspector on
pre-retirement leave, said that it was not unusual in pre-Internet days for
test-takers to collaborate and produce their own keys.

The hard-studiers would get together and post their answers, he said in an
interview. They would get passed around the command.

Put Finger on DCAS

Mr. McLaughlin, Mr. Carrasco, the LBA and the Ser­geants Benevolent
Association all said the problem is with the Department of Citywide
Administrative Services, which administers civil-service tests. They claimed
DCAS leaves too much time between the original test and the makeup test and
repeats most of the questions from the first exam on the second exam. Also,
they agreed, the test was poorly constructed.

The [small] number of people who passed indicates it was not a fair test,
Mr. Turco said of the initial exam.

SBA President Edward D. Mullins told the Daily News he believed Police
Commissioner William J. Bratton in freezing all promotions before the court
order lost his mindThe issue is that there are 80 people who took the
makeup test, and theres alleged cheating on that, and he just labeled
everyone who took the first test as a cheater.

Mr. Carrasco agreed, saying, The real injustice here is in delaying the
promotion of those who were not involved in any wrongdoing. He said Rising
Star believes only a small number of test-takers may have cheated.

Someone from DCAS should be held accountable for this, Lieutenant Turco
said. He said the time lag between the original and the makeup test was
just unacceptable. We should learn from this. DCAS is not answering
questions about problems with the test, he said.

NYPD, Law Dept. Mum

The NYPD and the Department of Law have declined to comment on the problems
with the test. The Police Department said only that it and DCAS were
reviewing whatever complaints were registered.

DCAS is looking at issues raised concerning the scheduling of makeup exams.
Agen­cy officials said it takes three to four months to develop each exam,
which is written by DCAS personnel with the aid of subject-matter experts
from the NYPD.

For the Lieutenants list at issue, in between the original test and the
makeup, on May 13 and 14, DCAS held a protest session during which
test-takers could challenge any questions they thought were unfair or didnt
credit the right answers. Thats standard procedure for civil-service exams.

Test-takers were provided with a copy of the questionsa list of the
answers the test-taker selected, and an answer key, which contained a list
of the official correct answers, according to the lawsuit, which was filed
March 24.

Didnt Search Them

While test-takers attending a protest session are advised that they are not
permitted to bring in any electronic devices, they were not searched prior
to entering.

After the protest session, the suit said, the Lieutenant exam questions and
answers were circulated among several Sergeants prior to the makeup date
via, among other methods, an online message board frequented by NYPD
officers known as Rising Star

A post on Rising Star dated May 13, 2015 contains a photograph of the list
of officially correct answers. This answer key is identical to the one
provided to the test-takers at the protest session.

The suit also alleged problems with the way the original test was
administered: test-takers were not searched before entering the testing
rooms, cell-phones and other electronic devices that could be used to
photograph the exam were not removed, many proctors remained at the front of
the room instead of circulating through it, test-takers were observed
talking to each other in the bathrooms. The test was given in high-school
classrooms, and many test-takers were disturbed by the sound of other
activities, Mr. McLaughlin said.

Atrocious Conditions

I think the conditions were atrocious, he said.

His clients do not believe the exam was fair, he said, adding that some
questions asked about topics that were not listed on the Notice of
Examination published by DCAS. They should take those ques­tions that
involved issues my clients had no notice of and strike them from the exam,
he said.

The exam did not test the knowledge thats needed for the rank of
Lieutenant, Mr. Carrasco said. He said the initial test needed to be
re-graded on a curve so more people would pass.

Mr. Turco said the current list with 240 names was a small one, noting that
the last Lieutenants promotion list had about 650 names. He said that the
list would be exhausted fairly quickly but that DCAS would just schedule
another test.

Mr. McLaughlin said that DCAS has ignored protests and that a restructuring
of the entire process is necessary. First, he said, exams should not be
held on Saturdays. Second, he said, makeup exams should be held before the
protest sessions.

Check the Board

To identify people who may have cheated, he said, investigators should look
at the Rising Star message board and identify the Internet addresses of
postersa process he said would take a court order, or at least a subpoena.

Mr. Carrasco agreed that DCAS needs to change the way they administer the
makeup test. It needs to be different, content-wise. Mr. Mullins said the
questions on both tests were the same, just in different order.

The low pass rate for the first exam, Mr. Carrasco said, has nothing to do
with lack of interestPeople put their lives on hold to study for this test,
they delay getting married, having kids

Many Sergeants may never take another promotional exam because theyre so
disgusted with the system. It doesnt help the job when you have
disillusioned Sergeants.




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Well written article .... Lists some of legitimate issues .

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eze


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My official stance on this matter is this test should be graded on a curve (lower the pass mark by 5-10 points or throw out the ambiguous questions) and, going forward, the make-up exam should be different content-wise from the original exam. For fairness sake DCAS could set the make-up pass mark to match the pass mark of the original test (so if 30% pass the original exam then 30% should pass the make-up exam).



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Eze with u retiring...you guys gonna still pump out the rising star packets for future tests?

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67 on 2015 Lt Exam. DISGRACE!

 

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2017



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eze wrote:

My official stance on this matter is this test should be graded on a curve (lower the pass mark by 5-10 points or throw out the ambiguous questions) and, going forward, the make-up exam should be different content-wise from the original exam. For fairness sake DCAS could set the make-up pass mark to match the pass mark of the original test (so if 30% pass the original exam then 30% should pass the make-up exam).


 The matching of the pass mark of the original test is very interesting, sound fair.



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Grading the exam on a curve and adding more people does not eliminate the fact that people still cheated and that is the major reason why the job put promotions on hold. They do not want to promote cheaters.

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eze


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Su Madre 24 wrote:

Eze with u retiring...you guys gonna still pump out the rising star packets for future tests?


 Absolutely. I got rid of our PG notes and replaced it with the Essential Guide--so I've been working on that. We're also contemplating going live (or do a combination of study-at-home and live classes...)



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"His clients do not believe the exam was fair, he said, adding that some
questions asked about topics that were not listed on the Notice of
Examination published by DCAS. They should take those ques­tions that
involved issues my clients had no notice of and strike them from the exam,
he said.

The exam did not test the knowledge thats needed for the rank of
Lieutenant, Mr. Carrasco said. He said the initial test needed to be
re-graded on a curve so more people would pass."

 

This is the meat and potatoes of the lawsuit I think.  The cheating should be dealt with, but its not the main issue.  The main issue is the test was ridiculous and the TVB was corrupted..... EZE I completely agree with you something needs to be done about his test....



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eze


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Ineed63 wrote:
eze wrote:

My official stance on this matter is this test should be graded on a curve (lower the pass mark by 5-10 points or throw out the ambiguous questions) and, going forward, the make-up exam should be different content-wise from the original exam. For fairness sake DCAS could set the make-up pass mark to match the pass mark of the original test (so if 30% pass the original exam then 30% should pass the make-up exam).


 The matching of the pass mark of the original test is very interesting, sound fair.


 Thanks. It seems like the only fair alternative. Holding the test on a weekday would not be doable since it would be a logistical nightmare (think classroom space, traffic, parking, etc) and there would still be a need for make-up exams (from LODs and military). The purpose of the make-up exam is so that DCAS can "reasonably accommodate" Sabbath observers; they could say here, we accommodated you by making a totally different test from the original exam. I can't see this not passing a "fairness" test. The reason it's not done now is because it's more work for DCAS--so the issue isn't fairness, it's laziness.   You have 5 UMOS assigned to DCAS for 4-5 months writing a 100-130 question test. You know what? write 2 or 3 100-130 question test. That's 1 test every 1.5 months among 5 people. So you only get 3 hours for lunch and the gym instead of 5-6.



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Just my opinion but the job knows that DCAS sets the rules regarding the exam. The only reason this list is being held up is because of cheating allegations. Not because DCAS did not throw out questions, or put information on it passed the cut off date. The job doesn't get involved in DCAS findings. They never have. They did not care to look into any of our gripes until a lawsuit was filed and the basis of that lawsuit is cheating.

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eze wrote:
Ineed63 wrote:
eze wrote:

My official stance on this matter is this test should be graded on a curve (lower the pass mark by 5-10 points or throw out the ambiguous questions) and, going forward, the make-up exam should be different content-wise from the original exam. For fairness sake DCAS could set the make-up pass mark to match the pass mark of the original test (so if 30% pass the original exam then 30% should pass the make-up exam).


 The matching of the pass mark of the original test is very interesting, sound fair.


 Thanks. It seems like the only fair alternative. Holding the test on a weekday would not be doable since it would be a logistical nightmare (think classroom space, traffic, parking, etc) and there would still be a need for make-up exams (from LODs and military). The purpose of the make-up exam is so that DCAS can "reasonably accommodate" Sabbath observers; they could say here, we accommodated you by making a totally different test from the original exam. I can't see this not passing a "fairness" test. The reason it's not done now is because it's more work for DCAS--so the issue isn't fairness, it's laziness.   You have 5 UMOS assigned to DCAS for 4-5 months writing a 100-130 question test. You know what? write 2 or 3 100-130 question test. That's 1 test every 1.5 months among 5 people. So you only get 3 hours for lunch and the gym instead of 5-6.


 Or how about some damn oversight from the department on whats being written on the exam. A DI or above with some level of common sense could've seen where the exam was going just by sitting in on the writing sessions for a week or two. Then report those findings to the First dep. 



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I agree with samiam the job didn't give a **** about all our complaints, but now that the lawsuit and social media is bringing everything to light they are trying to either cover it up or do the right thing by reopen the TVB. I still cant believe #1 wasn't a double answer.
I also agree with eze to grade this test with a curve and any future test be given during the week in our new police academy.
You can't give 2 different sets of questions, that will lead to another lawsuit on how one test was easier than the other. Atleast with giving the test during the week in the academy it will stop alot of The scammers.

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Im curious to see what the job does with this one. I doubt they froze the list to do absolutely nothing. I also doubt they will toss the list cause although theres cheaters, its very unlikely they can confirm all the cheaters and theres still legitimate passers. Which only leaves me to speculate the job in conjunction with dcas will attempt do something to right this wrong. But what? Time will tell

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