A lot of discussion has been had about the last 30 or so questions on this test. You know, the questions that supposedly had a "right" answer if you got some obscure $99 book off Amazon. A book that is basically filled with opinions of two authors about how to "supervise police personnel." A book that was NOT referenced by the notice of examination, not issued by the Department and not on the bookcase in any CO's office next to his 30 or so John Maxwell books.
Verbatim from the notice of examination:
The test may include questions which require mastery of technical knowledge based on such materials as: the NYCPD Patrol Guide, New York State Penal Law, Criminal Procedure Law, Family Court Act, Vehicle & Traffic Laws (VTL), Assistance Services such as Early Intervention Programs, services provided by other police units, procedures for use of the FINEST computer system and for the use of SPRINT computer system, 311 System, and Mayors Executive Order No. 16 of 1978, as amended, and knowledge of department procedures and guidelines regarding the use of forms, reports, logs, written narrative reports, response situations, disciplinary matters, personnel matters and special patrol operation
But...
What about the patrol guide. These were the hardest most poorly written P.G. questions ever on any promotional test. 90% of them leave room for debate and some have flat out errors in them. Others cross the line of what we were responsible for on this test.
The grammar: yes there were a couple of "gimmies" i.e. "should of" instead of "should have." But the rest were ridiculously hard and I'm not embarassed to say it.
Math: A lot of you guys are saying the math was "fair." I guess it was due (not do) to the fact that each question has a definite answer. Ok, but math this complex has never been tested before on these exams and I personally have not seen it since AP statistics in high school.
As for the guys saying they're happy the job gave a test where you were tested on more than just memorizing the patrol guide....get over yourself.
These tests have been based on the concept of studying the department manual since Moses wore short pants. You non studiers are just happy you may have caught lightning in a bottle.
PatrolGuideismyBible said
Nov 1, 2011
I was pressed for time, so the math questions, the reading comprehension, and grammar were time consuming for even the fair ones. I don't even remember if I picked up on "should of" vs. "should have", I def would have if I had enough time to go over everything. I remember the Sgt's exam I had enough time to take the test and reread every single question and look for any glaring errors I may have made, like picking the most correct when the questions was asking for the least correct. Didn't have time to fine tune my answers on this one...
oneadditional said
Nov 1, 2011
DID ANYONE GET 2 SQUADS AS AN ANSWER MEANING 2 SQUADS WERE TIED FOR THE ANSWER FOR THE LAST 2 MATH QUESTIONS
PatrolGuideismyBible said
Nov 1, 2011
I didn't, but I interpreted "most improved" or "most productive" as summons per cop per tour on patrol. I have no idea whether or not I interpreted those math questions correctly though. My math was sound, but I cannot say I know for a fact what they were asking...
RISING IDIOT said
Nov 1, 2011
oneadditional wrote:
DID ANYONE GET 2 SQUADS AS AN ANSWER MEANING 2 SQUADS WERE TIED FOR THE ANSWER FOR THE LAST 2 MATH QUESTIONS
for the last math question i had 2 squads were tied for the best improvement which was a choice
nycop80 said
Nov 1, 2011
b3
RumorMill said
Nov 1, 2011
RISING IDIOT wrote:
oneadditional wrote:
DID ANYONE GET 2 SQUADS AS AN ANSWER MEANING 2 SQUADS WERE TIED FOR THE ANSWER FOR THE LAST 2 MATH QUESTIONS
for the last math question i had 2 squads were tied for the best improvement which was a choice
they were different by point someting. it was cheap
FNM said
Nov 1, 2011
This needs to be thrown out, period. Myself and a couple of other guys are discussing things with different lawyers today to discuss. I woukd assume that based on the fact that most of us spent over $1000 on study material alone, not to mention wasted vacation days, and lost opportunities for overtime, there might be monetary compensation involved for those who join the lawsuit. I will keep everyone posted
Mes018 said
Nov 1, 2011
RISING IDIOT wrote:
oneadditional wrote:
DID ANYONE GET 2 SQUADS AS AN ANSWER MEANING 2 SQUADS WERE TIED FOR THE ANSWER FOR THE LAST 2 MATH QUESTIONS
for the last math question i had 2 squads were tied for the best improvement which was a choice
F@$k...anybody sure? I had only one squad with an improvement from 2010 to 2011. Based it off of summons per cop average in each squad. I'm not sure which one, b-1 I think, went up very slightly. The other 2 squads went down a little cause they had less cops in 2010 but wrote almost the same amount as the 2011 squads with an extra cop or two.
Jimmy McNulty said
Nov 1, 2011
Rising idiot you hit the nail on the head. Aside from ALL the nonsense and trickery that was on this test, the test was unfair because no one could have properly prepared for it. Some people who barely studied are going to pass in the low 70's because they do better with those opinionated type of questions than someone who dedicated themselves to studying the Department Manual for 7 months, which has been the basis of promotional exams since time began. I spoke to my Captain yesterday who said they had 3-5 questions like that on his Captains test, but they drop around 50 of them on us out of no where? I could have dealt with studying hard and failing an extremely hard test because it was just that, but failing because a few test writers are trying to be pioneers is tough to swallow. As stupid as that book is, I'd rather have a Boss who knows a department procedure like the back of his hand as apposed to one who knows how to comfort a crying PAA. Feels like a bad dream....
PatrolGuideismyBible said
Nov 1, 2011
Well Jimmy McNulty, we will be saluting a Lt that knew better than us how to comfort a crying PAA, enable stealing of toilet paper, shytcan EEO's, interpret "most productive", know what to do with an orange syringe cap, know pregnant female district surgeon rules (which was actually one of the few fair questions even though it is obscure, it was worded well enough if you knew the material), and knew what to say to the senior Sgt who didn't get the gig he wanted. Hopefully that same Lt will console me when I am crying about this test and how I didn't get promoted after giving up 6 months of my life and about $2000...
smartcookie said
Nov 1, 2011
Mes018 wrote:
RISING IDIOT wrote:
oneadditional wrote:
DID ANYONE GET 2 SQUADS AS AN ANSWER MEANING 2 SQUADS WERE TIED FOR THE ANSWER FOR THE LAST 2 MATH QUESTIONS
for the last math question i had 2 squads were tied for the best improvement which was a choice
F@$k...anybody sure? I had only one squad with an improvement from 2010 to 2011. Based it off of summons per cop average in each squad. I'm not sure which one, b-1 I think, went up very slightly. The other 2 squads went down a little cause they had less cops in 2010 but wrote almost the same amount as the 2011 squads with an extra cop or two.
Mes018: You are correct. The two squads did not have an improvement. It was that one squad that went up slightly.
E D said
Nov 1, 2011
I think I got 2 squads tie for the second one. It's all a blur though.
A lot of discussion has been had about the last 30 or so questions on this test. You know, the questions that supposedly had a "right" answer if you got some obscure $99 book off Amazon. A book that is basically filled with opinions of two authors about how to "supervise police personnel." A book that was NOT referenced by the notice of examination, not issued by the Department and not on the bookcase in any CO's office next to his 30 or so John Maxwell books.
Verbatim from the notice of examination:
The test may include questions which require mastery of technical knowledge based on such materials as: the NYCPD Patrol Guide, New York State Penal Law, Criminal Procedure Law, Family Court Act, Vehicle & Traffic Laws (VTL), Assistance Services such as Early Intervention Programs, services provided by other police units, procedures for use of the FINEST computer system and for the use of SPRINT computer system, 311 System, and Mayors Executive Order No. 16 of 1978, as amended, and knowledge of department procedures and guidelines regarding the use of forms, reports, logs, written narrative reports, response situations, disciplinary matters, personnel matters and special patrol operation
But...
What about the patrol guide. These were the hardest most poorly written P.G. questions ever on any promotional test. 90% of them leave room for debate and some have flat out errors in them. Others cross the line of what we were responsible for on this test.
The grammar: yes there were a couple of "gimmies" i.e. "should of" instead of "should have." But the rest were ridiculously hard and I'm not embarassed to say it.
Math: A lot of you guys are saying the math was "fair." I guess it was due (not do) to the fact that each question has a definite answer. Ok, but math this complex has never been tested before on these exams and I personally have not seen it since AP statistics in high school.
As for the guys saying they're happy the job gave a test where you were tested on more than just memorizing the patrol guide....get over yourself.
These tests have been based on the concept of studying the department manual since Moses wore short pants. You non studiers are just happy you may have caught lightning in a bottle.
for the last math question i had 2 squads were tied for the best improvement which was a choice
they were different by point someting. it was cheap
Mes018: You are correct. The two squads did not have an improvement. It was that one squad that went up slightly.