Shame on the SBA, corrupt to the core, vote these clowns out
Spanish mama said
Oct 14, 2023
For sure. Guy slithered in with no vote. VP was a shit boss when he was on patrol. Personally acquainted during times of CRV.
No1isbetter said
Oct 14, 2023
They do NOT have the best interest of 1500-2000 Sergeants, only those prior & those now entering at Top Pay. He sold us out. The extra year to top pay & this sad excuse of a contract they agreed to.
Futureauxiliary said
Oct 14, 2023
We need new blood!
UncleC69 said
Oct 14, 2023
The delagates need to vote him out. The reason Patty and these clowns all stayed so long is because the delegates never bothered challenging anyone. If there were a tier 3 Sba delegate who could string together a sentence or two theyd win by a landslide. Im very serious about the issues the membership is facing, the board cant possibly fathom it. Forget pay for a second, the litany of issues impacting daily police operations are absurd and just getting worse.
Having a no show union may work on the sopranos, but not in this thing of ours. I apologize to everyone because I know when I sat in bmoc I was led to believe that I finally became a part of the best union on the job. I was surely mistaken, but this doesnt mean it cant be turned around. This is a fight that needs courage and conviction, the lack of urgency and transparency is something that cant be forgotten.
Please stay safe
Fraternally,
The Uncle
Tier3scum said
Oct 14, 2023
When Mullins was in the president seat. We definitely had the strongest and most vocal union. Im by no means defending what he did. But this guy running the show now is an empty suit. The VP as stated above is a do nothing miserable fu**. Personally dealt with him when I was a rookie in impact back in 2011. Tier 3 members need to stop being so complacent and start getting in the game. We have to be at least half the members on the job now. No one in tier 2 is concerned what so ever about tier 3 problems. The only way well ever fix the issues such as the top pay disparity and pension things like the SS offset is by getting tier 3 members involved in the unions and not just precinct level delegates
-- Edited by Tier3scum on Saturday 14th of October 2023 05:48:08 PM
passfail said
Oct 14, 2023
And dont forget the Tier 3 Pension Loan program that was signed into law in May this year and the pension fund is dragging their feet to make it available to Tier 3 personnel. Im sure if there was a tier 3 pension fund board member we wouldve had this implemented before the end of the summer.
NauseousPBBN said
Oct 14, 2023
There's no need to waste time insulting the union. The only thing that will get their attention is when we vote.
Ultimately the energy spent here should be spent educating the 95% of people affected that don't read the forums. All this is for nothing if we still get 70%+ vote of yes on anything they put in front of us.
TenFour16 said
Oct 14, 2023
Yea, i agree that these guys dont give a horses ass about tier 3 people. Their favorite cop out is that we are the entitled generation.
Idea: Start finding a way to get every Sgts department email address and start that way since not everyone reads these forums.
Tier3scum said
Oct 14, 2023
If they can vote out the speaker of the house, we should be able to get enough tier 3 sgts educated to get this guy out next election. Social media is going to play a huge part in this. The satire pages. They ripped patty apart. Do the same thing with Vin. Unfortunately some of the people on the job now, the only way to get through to them is social media. They dont get their news or facts from anywhere else.
Taketheday said
Oct 14, 2023
Tier3scum wrote:
If they can vote out the speaker of the house, we should be able to get enough tier 3 sgts educated to get this guy out next election. Social media is going to play a huge part in this. The satire pages. They ripped patty apart. Do the same thing with Vin. Unfortunately some of the people on the job now, the only way to get through to them is social media. They dont get their news or facts from anywhere else.
I agree Social Media is the only way these days most people remember a funny cop meme more than any actual info that deals with their pay and retirement
VetteCop said
Oct 15, 2023
could probably FOIL the department for email addresses.... that being said how does rising star email the entire department? lol
SaltyCrimeGuy said
Oct 16, 2023
You have to love when the newly promoted SGT comes to the pct to pick up some stuff from their old locker and tell you how theyre bringing home roughly $1,000 more than me a paycheck. Good times!
RachDawg said
Oct 16, 2023
Make sure you show up on the 26th and let them know!
Order66 said
Oct 16, 2023
Show up for your friends, coworkers and most importantly your families. Fair pay now! The pay we are gettin was too little for the cops! Their argument for PO was inflation has made their pay irrelevant. Wtf does that mean for us sorry kid, thats how it is. We all Had to eat sh*t. Its your turn WE DEMAND RESULTS OR THEY ARE GONE. SIMPLE! SHAME ON THE SBA.
NYM said
Oct 17, 2023
Remember if we do not have any imminent contract signing before 10/26, that means that the meeting is going to be a bunch of BS about how they are still working on the contract. If a contract was about to happen, there would be an emergency meeting to hold a vote. The closer we get to the 10/26 without a contract the more likely it is that it's going to get pushed back to November/December.
The SBA is not fighting for you, if they were the contract would have been signed already. The SBA board has no interest settling this contract because it does not benefit them, they are already at top pay. They are trying to line their pockets with more cash by trying to get the city to pay them extra money for the 12 hours tours. They couldn't care less about new sergeants making 20k more than you or the cops you supervise making more than you.
I will post the details of the meeting here on 10/26 for everyone to see.
countryroads said
Oct 17, 2023
This is starting to get increasingly frustrating. The SBA needs to make this right.
Taketheday said
Oct 17, 2023
NYM wrote:
Remember if we do not have any imminent contract signing before 10/26, that means that the meeting is going to be a bunch of BS about how they are still working on the contract. If a contract was about to happen, there would be an emergency meeting to hold a vote. The closer we get to the 10/26 without a contract the more likely it is that it's going to get pushed back to November/December.
The SBA is not fighting for you, if they were the contract would have been signed already. The SBA board has no interest settling this contract because it does not benefit them, they are already at top pay. They are trying to line their pockets with more cash by trying to get the city to pay them extra money for the 12 hours tours. They couldn't care less about new sergeants making 20k more than you or the cops you supervise making more than you.
I will post the details of the meeting here on 10/26 for everyone to see.
Thank you at least someone cares enough to share some info
NauseousPBBN said
Oct 17, 2023
Don't post meeting info on this public board. If anyone wants it and you want to share them send through private message.
Regardless how we feel about union at the moment, they are still in active negotiations with the city, letting the city know what the union is thinking or planning doesn't help anyone but the city.
SaltyCrimeGuy said
Oct 17, 2023
I doubt the sba has any plans the city already isnt aware of. They just lost the battle on 12 hour tours because the LBA is agreeing to them. It would be stupid to keep fighting it. Fix the pay disparity! Thats the biggest issue right now. NO NCO money, BWC money and most likely no pay bump for 12 hour tours. The sba is really showing the city how to negotiate a contract!
Over It said
Oct 17, 2023
Lets look at the track record of the current SBA administration:
Signed a terrible contract with an extra year to top pay, which no other union did.
Joined a coalition for raises, so accomplished nothing singularly.
Said they were fighting 12 hour tours and apparently are losing that fight.
Created 3 separate tiers of pay of newly promoted sergeants where the newest sergeants make the most money, and the senior sergeants make less than a PO.
They werent voted in by anyone. Vinny hasnt even publicly lambasted the city for allowing this. Disgraceful.
The next election, unless this guys fixes this mess by some miracle, if anyone votes for Vinny I wont know what to say. He has been a HORRENDOUS president these last two years. Vote him out, thats what must happen.
-- Edited by Over It on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 12:33:41 PM
-- Edited by Over It on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 12:34:13 PM
NauseousPBBN said
Oct 17, 2023
I think you all are forgetting the most significant part...WE voted those horrible conditions into existence.
Blame the union all we want but that extra pay step, delayed NCO money..all of it was voted 77% IN FAVOR of contract.
Tier3scum said
Oct 17, 2023
When is the next election? Has anyone even come out and run against him. Thats another reason a lot of these guys stay in power. I came on in 2011 and didnt get promoted until 2020. Maybe my memory is escaping me but I only remember voting in 1 election. If these guys run unopposed, whats the urgency for them to change anything. If all we do is piss and moan here and then the bell rings and we have no one else with our best interest in mind. They see it as well I must be doing a great job. Why should I change. No one even challenged me. And unfortunately theres a ton of people on this job, all ranks who will see only retro and hit yes. They wont read anything else. If they put in a fine line saying you dont have a pension anymore but youre gonna get a 50 grand retro. There would be plenty of people who hit yes. Ive spoken to tier 3 rookies in my command who didnt even know OT still counts in your pension. Thats mind blowing. This is your life. Your money. Your family. How the fu** do you not know what youre entitled to. But thats the mentality of this new breed. No one takes the job because they wanna be cops or do police work or because they know if you give at least 22 years to this city, you get a paycheck until the day you die. Thats why social media is going to play a tremendous part of the next election. Most of the new cops coming on dont watch the news. They watch tik tok and instagram. Their news is whats app breaking news threads. And that generation of cops are becoming sgts. Get the message out no matter how, this administration needs to go and its time new blood tier 3 members are coming up in the unions. Theres tier 3 captains now, how are we still getting awful representation from guys who havent put a uniform on in 20 years.
-- Edited by Tier3scum on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 01:15:28 PM
Over It said
Oct 17, 2023
NauseousPBBN wrote:
I think you all are forgetting the most significant part...WE voted those horrible conditions into existence.
Blame the union all we want but that extra pay step, delayed NCO money..all of it was voted 77% IN FAVOR of contract.
Yes, I was opposed to the contract vehemently back then, and we had less Tier 3 bosses at that time. Not sure if that contract would pass today. Also 77% is a very low number for a contract vote, it shows how bad the contract really was. Look at the PBA, it was like 97-98% in favor.
Over It said
Oct 17, 2023
Tier3scum wrote:
When is the next election? Has anyone even come out and run against him. Thats another reason a lot of these guys stay in power. I came on in 2011 and didnt get promoted until 2020. Maybe my memory is escaping me but I only remember voting in 1 election. If these guys run unopposed, whats the urgency for them to change anything. If all we do is piss and moan here and then the bell rings and we have no one else with our best interest in mind. They see it as well I must be doing a great job. Why should I change. No one even challenged me. And unfortunately theres a ton of people on this job, all ranks who will see only retro and hit yes. They wont read anything else. If they put in a fine line saying you dont have a pension anymore but youre gonna get a 50 grand retro. There would be plenty of people who hit yes. Ive spoken to tier 3 rookies in my command who didnt even know OT still counts in your pension. Thats mind blowing. This is your life. Your money. Your family. How the fu** do you not know what youre entitled to. But thats the mentality of this new breed. No one takes the job because they wanna be cops or do police work or because they know if you give at least 22 years to this city, you get a paycheck until the day you die. Thats why social media is going to play a tremendous part of the next election. Most of the new cops coming on dont watch the news. They watch tik tok and instagram. Their news is whats app breaking news threads. And that generation of cops are becoming sgts. Get the message out no matter how, this administration needs to go and its time new blood tier 3 members are coming up in the unions. Theres tier 3 captains now, how are we still getting awful representation from guys who havent put a uniform on in 20 years.
-- Edited by Tier3scum on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 01:15:28 PM
Agreed
SBA MIA said
Oct 17, 2023
The SBA put out some weak Instagram post saying its inexcusable that a sgt with 4 yrs in rank makes less than a PO. The only thing thats inexcusable is that they have allowed this to continue day after day. Each day that passes they lose more and more. Everyone knows they are lost and have no idea how to manage the union money let alone negotiate on behalf of 2000+ sgts they allowed to be in this situation
TenFour16 said
Oct 17, 2023
They dont give a shit.
RachDawg said
Oct 17, 2023
Yea they are going to try to salvage their reputation...too little too late
Order66 said
Oct 18, 2023
Vote of no confidence.
SaltyCrimeGuy said
Oct 19, 2023
Another day of 0 information from the SBA!
Taketheday said
Oct 19, 2023
This union is pathetic. I cant wait until they present our contract in December with no pay disparity being addressed and them saying the % are a win for us to get our raise that way since they obviously are too scared to just admit the City DOES not want to fix i.
Bunch of SGT in my command are talking about starting an online Petition for SGT to sign asking for better representation from the SBA I think thats a good option for most of us when its up and running ill post the link here and start getting Union Members to sign it
3testwonder said
Oct 19, 2023
Perfect
Spanish mama said
Oct 19, 2023
Good idea
NauseousPBBN said
Oct 19, 2023
Hold you delegate accountable. Send him off to next weeks delegate meeting with a list of questions. If you every command does the same then they have no choice to discuss it at meeting and get us some type of answer.
1) How do we get access to union bylaws?
2) When is next general election for the board?
3) What are the requirements to run?
4) What is the update on disparity and retro owed besides the general fluff sent out?
Everyone get on same page and check back on the 27th.
UncleC69 said
Oct 19, 2023
They need to be challenged. We need delegates that are willing to challenge the board. I am very interested in taking this on. I suggest that people start speaking with sgts at the commands. The boards vulnerable. Tier 2 boards should no longer be a thing for the Pba and/or Sba. Once this current sgt list is exhausted the overwhelming majority of sgts will be tier 3. People need awareness and appropriate information. Theres something to say about the board remaining intact. Theres something to say about the lack of transparency/actionable information. Theres a big opportunity here for a hungry tier 3 candidate.
Fraternally,
The uncle
Braveheart said
Oct 20, 2023
UncleC69 wrote:
They need to be challenged. We need delegates that are willing to challenge the board. I am very interested in taking this on. I suggest that people start speaking with sgts at the commands. The boards vulnerable. Tier 2 boards should no longer be a thing for the Pba and/or Sba. Once this current sgt list is exhausted the overwhelming majority of sgts will be tier 3. People need awareness and appropriate information. Theres something to say about the board remaining intact. Theres something to say about the lack of transparency/actionable information. Theres a big opportunity here for a hungry tier 3 candidate.
Fraternally,
The uncle
I was with you until you said, "Tier 2 boards should no longer be a thing for the Pba and/or Sba."
Spanish mama said
Oct 20, 2023
Plot twist. Uncle is really Mullins
TicketoutofNarco said
Oct 20, 2023
Braveheart wrote:
UncleC69 wrote:
They need to be challenged. We need delegates that are willing to challenge the board. I am very interested in taking this on. I suggest that people start speaking with sgts at the commands. The boards vulnerable. Tier 2 boards should no longer be a thing for the Pba and/or Sba. Once this current sgt list is exhausted the overwhelming majority of sgts will be tier 3. People need awareness and appropriate information. Theres something to say about the board remaining intact. Theres something to say about the lack of transparency/actionable information. Theres a big opportunity here for a hungry tier 3 candidate.
Fraternally,
The uncle
I was with you until you said, "Tier 2 boards should no longer be a thing for the Pba and/or Sba."
Same
VetteCop said
Oct 21, 2023
VetteCop wrote:
No1isbetter wrote:
Imagine being a Sergeant who spent every year of that no PBA contract just to make Rank thinking youll make more only for the very same PBA now making more $$ than you.
embarrassing... If the number really is 2000 sergeants that are caught in this bermuda's triangle - that's just under half of the amount of sergeants on this job... according to NYPD online there is about 4200... if the next contract sucks in terms of retro and sergeants actually band together it could easily be vetoed.
also, a quick reminder:
VetteCop wrote:
MuhlikCritty wrote:
I have spoken to several Sgts who have no idea about the top pay disparity, that we deserve retroactive payments, or that our union dues even went up without a single email or notification.
Since on this job, number speak louder than words, I have crunched the numbers to see how much retro is owed due to the disparity:
Promotion Date
Retro
Promotion Date
Retro
01/30/18
$10,053
11/24/20
$47,224
03/27/18
$13,147
12/22/20
$47,259
06/05/18
$17,013
01/29/21
$47,307
07/27/18
$19,886
03/18/21
$47,367
08/31/18
$21,936
06/10/21
$47,473
10/26/18
$25,246
07/30/21
$47,536
12/21/18
$28,557
09/10/21
$45,174
03/05/19
$32,932
10/18/21
$42,919
05/03/19
$36,420
02/09/22
$36,118
06/28/19
$39,731
05/27/22
$29,735
08/30/19
$43,471
06/22/22
$28,184
10/30/19
$45,619
07/22/22
$26,394
12/19/19
$45,840
08/26/22
$24,306
02/26/20
$46,145
09/30/22
$22,218
03/27/20
$46,273
10/28/22
$20,529
05/29/20
$46,551
11/23/22
$18,960
06/25/20
$46,671
12/23/22
$17,148
1. These were run up to todays date of October 3, 2023. They do not include longevity, overtime, etc...this was run using only base salaries. (which means retro would be more).
2. This is a rough estimate. I ran the numbers several times but no ones perfect.
3. Please do not confuse retro payments due to raises. This is completely separate.
4. I used the promotion dates I was able to get off the 2016 Sgt Forum but this applies to any class promoted after August 1, 2017
Bottom line, if you were promoted after August 1, 2017 up to the most recent classes, you were paid less than a Police Officer as of August 1, 2021.
We can go on and on about rumors and what delegates are and are not telling us, but you cant dispute numbers. The union might very well be fighting for this retro, and its just alot of misinformation, but at this point in time delegates are telling us that its a done deal, that the union will not attempt to get us this retro. Just remember, youre paying $1,400 a year in dues to have delegates tell you youre not getting paid whats owed.
Ultimately, many will say "job is dead" or "union sucks" but you have the final vote. Everytime there's subpar contract, there's a 70%+ vote for approval. If you vote yes for a contract in which the union doesnt even attempt to fight for compensation thats owed, then you only have yourself to blame.
-- Edited by MuhlikCritty on Wednesday 4th of October 2023 01:10:04 AM
^^^ THIS!!!
JUST ANOTHER REMINDER
NYM said
Oct 21, 2023
Remember if we don't hear about an emergency contract being held by Monday or Tuesday, that means the SBA will have no new news at this meeting other then "we are still in contract talks"!!!!! We will be going into November with no contract. Looks like the SBA trying to push this into December, to make us 2 years with no contract!
Blue71898 said
Oct 21, 2023
No one heard about an emergency contract for DEA and they settled the last meeting. Its going to happen how its going to happen. Lets not pretend we know.
Braveheart said
Oct 21, 2023
NYM wrote:
Remember if we don't hear about an emergency contract being held by Monday or Tuesday, that means the SBA will have no new news at this meeting other then "we are still in contract talks"!!!!! We will be going into November with no contract. Looks like the SBA trying to push this into December, to make us 2 years with no contract!
Patience my brother. If waiting this long means they fix the problem they created then I'm all for it. I rather them take their time and correct the issues rather then rushing a contract and problems not being fixed.
Taketheday said
Oct 21, 2023
Braveheart wrote:
NYM wrote:
Remember if we don't hear about an emergency contract being held by Monday or Tuesday, that means the SBA will have no new news at this meeting other then "we are still in contract talks"!!!!! We will be going into November with no contract. Looks like the SBA trying to push this into December, to make us 2 years with no contract!
Patience my brother. If waiting this long means they fix the problem they created then I'm all for it. I rather them take their time and correct the issues rather then rushing a contract and problems not being fixed.
The issue for us is that the longer they wait until December the more likely they wont fix it and just claim the % were the best they could do which at 10% is enough to get us over that 105,000 base that the PBA has. I believe that is their plan and they are just stalling. I could be wrong but the lack if information this far has me thinking that
Tunit said
Oct 21, 2023
We had a crooked union president and the rest of the quacks stayed in power when he left. The city has them by the balls. They couldnt push back if they even wanted to. We will get the bare minimum, expect nothing more.
Taketheday said
Oct 21, 2023
Some of the SGTs in my district started a petition on change.org when I go in later, Ill post it here
Over It said
Oct 21, 2023
Tunit wrote:
We had a crooked union president and the rest of the quacks stayed in power when he left. The city has them by the balls. They couldnt push back if they even wanted to. We will get the bare minimum, expect nothing more.
How is the ex-president in federal prison for defrauding the union and his VP slips in and has been running the union for two years? What kind of system is this? Get rid of him, doesnt deserve to be there. The SBA went from the consensus best union, to an absolute disgrace in 2 years. They dont seem to be fighting the city at all, and we cant trust their motives anymore. I promise you if your local trustee or director was making 96k right now, they would be going BALLISTIC. These guys dont care if it doesnt affect them, they are blowhards just toeing the company line, hoping for a promotion within the union, while spitting out cliches to placate the members. Get rid of Vinny and his crew, its time for a change. Thats the first step, we need to know the union is fighting for what we want. If they present a contract that doesnt meet our needs, it must be voted down.
sector7 said
Oct 21, 2023
I agree, there probably is no one or very few SBA Union officials who are not at top pay, so its difficult to trust they have our best interest in mind (especially if there is no recourse for us if they present and pass a poor contract). I do think we have their attention though.
We may not have enough Sergeants at lower pay steps to block a poor contract, but we have more than enough to vote this administration out if they fail. Do understand that during active negotiations no union will release specific details. Imagine we get a better offer than the LBA while they are voting. Then the LBA would pull back and go back to the table, which would hurt us if we didnt have a signed contract yet. So dont expect numbers or certain specifics, or even specific timelines until the SBA and city agree on contract.
However, what I would love to hear from the SBA is a statement that they will not settle until the pay disparity is fixed with a reasonable offer. All the SBA had said thus far is that it is their highest priority. Highest priority is not exactly reassuring, to me that they means they will TRY and does not guarantee they will DELIVER.
-- Edited by sector7 on Saturday 21st of October 2023 04:02:23 PM
Taketheday said
Oct 21, 2023
I had a Trustee tell me the other day that they dont see the pay Disparity getting fixed because it never gets fixed. Once youre on a pay scale youre screwed. Just know if Magically they make a Contract Offer in December that only includes percentages. Its them trying to buy you off. Everything else is stalling. Just Remember guys SBA Lowest Paid Uniform Members Of Service on the Payroll Currently for the next 4-5 years depending on time in Rank
A demotion would get you a raise FYI.
-- Edited by Taketheday on Saturday 21st of October 2023 04:53:48 PM
Tunit said
Oct 21, 2023
This entire Executive Board needs to go. I dont trust a single one of them. If it smells like crap, it probably is crap. Step down or retire! Now is the time for leadership that deserves to represent us, the ones actually out there doing The Toughest Job in the World! Its our butts on the line, its our futures on the line. Empty suits, the lot of them!
-- Edited by Tunit on Saturday 21st of October 2023 05:04:14 PM
NYM said
Oct 21, 2023
Blue71898 wrote:
No one heard about an emergency contract for DEA and they settled the last meeting. Its going to happen how its going to happen. Lets not pretend we know.
Im sorry that you are not informed on how a contract works. The union calls an emergency meeting for the delegates to vote on the contract, then it is given to the membership to vote. Happens every contract. So Im not pretending, looks like you dont know what you are talking about.
-- Edited by NYM on Saturday 21st of October 2023 07:21:51 PM
Braveheart said
Oct 21, 2023
Taketheday wrote:
I had a Trustee tell me the other day that they dont see the pay Disparity getting fixed because it never gets fixed. Once youre on a pay scale youre screwed. Just know if Magically they make a Contract Offer in December that only includes percentages. Its them trying to buy you off. Everything else is stalling. Just Remember guys SBA Lowest Paid Uniform Members Of Service on the Payroll Currently for the next 4-5 years depending on time in Rank
A demotion would get you a raise FYI.
-- Edited by Taketheday on Saturday 21st of October 2023 04:53:48 PM
Imagine if you're stuck a 96k for the next couple of years. And you're set to retired this year or next year. You might as well get demoted, get the pay raise and max out on overtime to secure a better pension.
Having a no show union may work on the sopranos, but not in this thing of ours. I apologize to everyone because I know when I sat in bmoc I was led to believe that I finally became a part of the best union on the job. I was surely mistaken, but this doesnt mean it cant be turned around. This is a fight that needs courage and conviction, the lack of urgency and transparency is something that cant be forgotten.
Please stay safe
Fraternally,
The Uncle
When Mullins was in the president seat. We definitely had the strongest and most vocal union. Im by no means defending what he did. But this guy running the show now is an empty suit. The VP as stated above is a do nothing miserable fu**. Personally dealt with him when I was a rookie in impact back in 2011. Tier 3 members need to stop being so complacent and start getting in the game. We have to be at least half the members on the job now. No one in tier 2 is concerned what so ever about tier 3 problems. The only way well ever fix the issues such as the top pay disparity and pension things like the SS offset is by getting tier 3 members involved in the unions and not just precinct level delegates
-- Edited by Tier3scum on Saturday 14th of October 2023 05:48:08 PM
Ultimately the energy spent here should be spent educating the 95% of people affected that don't read the forums. All this is for nothing if we still get 70%+ vote of yes on anything they put in front of us.
Idea: Start finding a way to get every Sgts department email address and start that way since not everyone reads these forums.
I agree Social Media is the only way these days most people remember a funny cop meme more than any actual info that deals with their pay and retirement
The SBA is not fighting for you, if they were the contract would have been signed already. The SBA board has no interest settling this contract because it does not benefit them, they are already at top pay. They are trying to line their pockets with more cash by trying to get the city to pay them extra money for the 12 hours tours. They couldn't care less about new sergeants making 20k more than you or the cops you supervise making more than you.
I will post the details of the meeting here on 10/26 for everyone to see.
Thank you at least someone cares enough to share some info
Regardless how we feel about union at the moment, they are still in active negotiations with the city, letting the city know what the union is thinking or planning doesn't help anyone but the city.
I doubt the sba has any plans the city already isnt aware of. They just lost the battle on 12 hour tours because the LBA is agreeing to them. It would be stupid to keep fighting it. Fix the pay disparity! Thats the biggest issue right now. NO NCO money, BWC money and most likely no pay bump for 12 hour tours. The sba is really showing the city how to negotiate a contract!
Lets look at the track record of the current SBA administration:
Signed a terrible contract with an extra year to top pay, which no other union did.
Joined a coalition for raises, so accomplished nothing singularly.
Said they were fighting 12 hour tours and apparently are losing that fight.
Created 3 separate tiers of pay of newly promoted sergeants where the newest sergeants make the most money, and the senior sergeants make less than a PO.
They werent voted in by anyone. Vinny hasnt even publicly lambasted the city for allowing this. Disgraceful.
The next election, unless this guys fixes this mess by some miracle, if anyone votes for Vinny I wont know what to say. He has been a HORRENDOUS president these last two years. Vote him out, thats what must happen.
-- Edited by Over It on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 12:33:41 PM
-- Edited by Over It on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 12:34:13 PM
Blame the union all we want but that extra pay step, delayed NCO money..all of it was voted 77% IN FAVOR of contract.
When is the next election? Has anyone even come out and run against him. Thats another reason a lot of these guys stay in power. I came on in 2011 and didnt get promoted until 2020. Maybe my memory is escaping me but I only remember voting in 1 election. If these guys run unopposed, whats the urgency for them to change anything. If all we do is piss and moan here and then the bell rings and we have no one else with our best interest in mind. They see it as well I must be doing a great job. Why should I change. No one even challenged me. And unfortunately theres a ton of people on this job, all ranks who will see only retro and hit yes. They wont read anything else. If they put in a fine line saying you dont have a pension anymore but youre gonna get a 50 grand retro. There would be plenty of people who hit yes. Ive spoken to tier 3 rookies in my command who didnt even know OT still counts in your pension. Thats mind blowing. This is your life. Your money. Your family. How the fu** do you not know what youre entitled to. But thats the mentality of this new breed. No one takes the job because they wanna be cops or do police work or because they know if you give at least 22 years to this city, you get a paycheck until the day you die. Thats why social media is going to play a tremendous part of the next election. Most of the new cops coming on dont watch the news. They watch tik tok and instagram. Their news is whats app breaking news threads. And that generation of cops are becoming sgts. Get the message out no matter how, this administration needs to go and its time new blood tier 3 members are coming up in the unions. Theres tier 3 captains now, how are we still getting awful representation from guys who havent put a uniform on in 20 years.
-- Edited by Tier3scum on Tuesday 17th of October 2023 01:15:28 PM
Yes, I was opposed to the contract vehemently back then, and we had less Tier 3 bosses at that time. Not sure if that contract would pass today. Also 77% is a very low number for a contract vote, it shows how bad the contract really was. Look at the PBA, it was like 97-98% in favor.
Agreed
Bunch of SGT in my command are talking about starting an online Petition for SGT to sign asking for better representation from the SBA I think thats a good option for most of us when its up and running ill post the link here and start getting Union Members to sign it
1) How do we get access to union bylaws?
2) When is next general election for the board?
3) What are the requirements to run?
4) What is the update on disparity and retro owed besides the general fluff sent out?
Everyone get on same page and check back on the 27th.
Fraternally,
The uncle
I was with you until you said, "Tier 2 boards should no longer be a thing for the Pba and/or Sba."
Same
JUST ANOTHER REMINDER
Patience my brother. If waiting this long means they fix the problem they created then I'm all for it. I rather them take their time and correct the issues rather then rushing a contract and problems not being fixed.
The issue for us is that the longer they wait until December the more likely they wont fix it and just claim the % were the best they could do which at 10% is enough to get us over that 105,000 base that the PBA has. I believe that is their plan and they are just stalling. I could be wrong but the lack if information this far has me thinking that
We had a crooked union president and the rest of the quacks stayed in power when he left. The city has them by the balls. They couldnt push back if they even wanted to. We will get the bare minimum, expect nothing more.
How is the ex-president in federal prison for defrauding the union and his VP slips in and has been running the union for two years? What kind of system is this? Get rid of him, doesnt deserve to be there. The SBA went from the consensus best union, to an absolute disgrace in 2 years. They dont seem to be fighting the city at all, and we cant trust their motives anymore. I promise you if your local trustee or director was making 96k right now, they would be going BALLISTIC. These guys dont care if it doesnt affect them, they are blowhards just toeing the company line, hoping for a promotion within the union, while spitting out cliches to placate the members. Get rid of Vinny and his crew, its time for a change. Thats the first step, we need to know the union is fighting for what we want. If they present a contract that doesnt meet our needs, it must be voted down.
I agree, there probably is no one or very few SBA Union officials who are not at top pay, so its difficult to trust they have our best interest in mind (especially if there is no recourse for us if they present and pass a poor contract). I do think we have their attention though.
We may not have enough Sergeants at lower pay steps to block a poor contract, but we have more than enough to vote this administration out if they fail. Do understand that during active negotiations no union will release specific details. Imagine we get a better offer than the LBA while they are voting. Then the LBA would pull back and go back to the table, which would hurt us if we didnt have a signed contract yet. So dont expect numbers or certain specifics, or even specific timelines until the SBA and city agree on contract.
However, what I would love to hear from the SBA is a statement that they will not settle until the pay disparity is fixed with a reasonable offer. All the SBA had said thus far is that it is their highest priority. Highest priority is not exactly reassuring, to me that they means they will TRY and does not guarantee they will DELIVER.
-- Edited by sector7 on Saturday 21st of October 2023 04:02:23 PM
I had a Trustee tell me the other day that they dont see the pay Disparity getting fixed because it never gets fixed. Once youre on a pay scale youre screwed. Just know if Magically they make a Contract Offer in December that only includes percentages. Its them trying to buy you off. Everything else is stalling. Just Remember guys SBA Lowest Paid Uniform Members Of Service on the Payroll Currently for the next 4-5 years depending on time in Rank
A demotion would get you a raise FYI.
-- Edited by Taketheday on Saturday 21st of October 2023 04:53:48 PM
This entire Executive Board needs to go. I dont trust a single one of them. If it smells like crap, it probably is crap. Step down or retire! Now is the time for leadership that deserves to represent us, the ones actually out there doing The Toughest Job in the World! Its our butts on the line, its our futures on the line. Empty suits, the lot of them!
-- Edited by Tunit on Saturday 21st of October 2023 05:04:14 PM
Im sorry that you are not informed on how a contract works. The union calls an emergency meeting for the delegates to vote on the contract, then it is given to the membership to vote. Happens every contract. So Im not pretending, looks like you dont know what you are talking about.
-- Edited by NYM on Saturday 21st of October 2023 07:21:51 PM
Imagine if you're stuck a 96k for the next couple of years. And you're set to retired this year or next year. You might as well get demoted, get the pay raise and max out on overtime to secure a better pension.