Hes too much of a pussy to walk into a Bronx or Brooklyn command

So Vinny cares more about rookie Sgts doing 1 summer of 12 hour tours, then he cares about more senior Sgts struggling financially for years?!?

Dear Fellow Sergeant, I write to share an update on the current status of our contract negotiations, which the SBA Board discussed yesterday during our regularly scheduled Board meeting. Unfortunately, the City has refused to back down from its position that the new contract must require sergeants to work 12-hour tours, despite my clearly explaining that such a requirement will negatively affect quality of life and safety for all members, among other concerns. As I explained at the last delegate meeting, a Memorandum of Agreement (MOA) was presented to us on February 28th. That MOA contained no mention of 12-hour tours, and the negotiating committee believed it was appropriate to present that MOA to the Executive Board and Directors. I signed the MOA and returned it to the SBAs counsel. After I did so, I was informed that the MOA offered was contingent on us agreeing to12-hour tours. The SBA has NEVER given the City any indication that we would agree to these tours and will not waiver on this point. In fact, there are numerous studies that prove they are detrimental to your physical and mental health, family life, and decision-making. In addition, there have been two separate delegate meetings where we took a vote on whether we would agree to the 12-hour tours to get the contract done. The first vote was 162 to 1, and the second vote was 163 to 0 against 12-hour tours in any format. As Ive also explained to the City for the past two years, the SBA will also not agree to a contract that would have one-quarter of our membership making less than a top pay police officer. It is pretty obvious that this is about saving face for hastily implementing a program that has had no real traction or supervision since its inception. SBA members should not and will not suffer because the City implemented 12-hour tours for police officers without including the SBA in the design of the program and approval of the SBA as required under collective bargaining. The SBAs position is not just in our members best interests, but also in the Citys best interests. In fact, a Department of Investigation (DOI) report from 2023, which our Department uses in the training of Internal Affairs investigators, describes an abundance of potential negative outcomes from police personnel being forced to work 12-hour tours. The negative outcomes include, but are not limited to, poor decision making; increases in civilian complaints, injuries, lawsuits, and misconduct; and physical and mental health and safety concerns. Knowing all of this, the City insists on 12-hour tours as a condition to implement the previously signed MOA. In the past, the union has successfully appealed to the Citys Mayor and Deputy Mayor to resolve contract-related stalemates. It is clear that the SBA must do that here, too, because despite that we are in mediation, our discussions with OLR, and NYPD Labor Policy remain at an impasse over 12-hour tours. We are requesting Mayor Adams intervene immediately so that this senseless insistence of these tours are removed and a contract can quickly be resolved as promised during the State of the City. There have been no promotions since the beginning of the year and at present the department is down 150 sergeants. With that shortage 900 plus sergeants are eligible to retire from now until June. This is a recipe for disaster. Included in this email is both the link and one of many excerpts from the DOI report that support our stance in this matter of paramount importance to the health and safety of the SBA membership. Fraternally, Vincent J. Vallelong President Sergeants Benevolent Association

I call bullsh*t to the 163-0 vote! When was this vote held? I think it's time all members start talking to their delegates and find out why they voted against it. Especially those delegates who work 12-hour right tours now in certain assignments.

Im curious to know what we pay the SBA attorneys. It appears the cuny lawyers are continuing to run circles around the SBA. I truthfully dont believe anyone on the board has any idea how to settle a contract. The SBA rushed the last contract because they tried to save face after the Mullins snafu. The last contract set us back and what the board is doing now is just disastrous. Dont blame the city- blame Vinny

I dont buy they conducted a vote with the delegates at all. Hes a self serving president. God forbid he goes unopposed or smalls gets in. Nightmare

His concern about the affects 12 hour tours has on MOS how about we talk about the affect getting paid $97k has on 1200+ members: Fear of not being able to make ends meet, Not affording a better home, Not being able to house shop, less money leads to unhealthy food choice to save a dollar, unable to afford extracurricular activities to stay active, unable to afford a weekly weekend entertainment with your significant other wherher its out to dinner, a show, a ball game with your family, its causing relationship issues, family issues, the stress is taking a toll on peoples health & well being, lack of motivation from it, leading to anxiety and depression as a result of all these things. Were all adults and how we decide to handle our jobs falls on us to be professional, I dont give a rats ass what your study says. Dont forget the thousands in interest tier 2 members are losing, the over taxation of our retro when that comes, the lack of overtime to help make up for this shitty pay. Wake the fuck up Vinny. Your delegate are fkn cowards, why are they so afraid to stand up to you? Are they guilted into shame for supporting a significant raise by accepting the 12 hours? This is disgusting. His email is all bullshit. Comes a time when you swallow your fucking Pride and admit you fucked up in 2021 & this is the best its going to be. If SBA doesnt accept this contract Im telling you its going to get ugly. Its not about you 163, its about us 1275. Fucking scumbag.

No1isbetter wrote:

---

His concern about the affects 12 hour tours has on MOS how about we talk about the affect getting paid $97k has on 1200+ members: Fear of not being able to make ends meet, Not affording a better home, Not being able to house shop, less money leads to unhealthy food choice to save a dollar, unable to afford extracurricular activities to stay active, unable to afford a weekly weekend entertainment with your significant other wherher its out to dinner, a show, a ball game with your family, its causing relationship issues, family issues, the stress is taking a toll on peoples health & well being, lack of motivation from it, leading to anxiety and depression as a result of all these things. Were all adults and how we decide to handle our jobs falls on us to be professional, I dont give a rats ass what your study says. Dont forget the thousands in interest tier 2 members are losing, the over taxation of our retro when that comes, the lack of overtime to help make up for this shitty pay. Wake the fuck up Vinny. Your delegate are fkn cowards, why are they so afraid to stand up to you? Are they guilted into shame for supporting a significant raise by accepting the 12 hours? This is disgusting. His email is all bullshit. Comes a time when you swallow your fucking Pride and admit you fucked up in 2021 & this is the best its going to be. If SBA doesnt accept this contract Im telling you its going to get ugly. Its not about you 163, its about us 1275. Fucking scumbag.

---

 Well said brother F** Vinny

We are cooked..voting 163-0 just goes to show you these delegates just want to stay in Vinnies good graces so they can get their little bullshit stipend and free breakfast. These delegates are usually the same people that dick ride the LTs and above In the precinct to get preferential treatment.

Whats annoying is the dept is so stingy with $, they wont promote people who actually passed a test but they will give out detective specialist shields like candy to do nothings with 3 years on

You and the 163 have zero credibility, vast majority voted in favor of that HORRIBLE 2021 contract. That email is just buying him time, 2026 is confirmed, unless city bends.

When I was in BMOC, I seem to remember we figured out that 12 hour tours would give us less vacation weeks every year. Can anyone confirm this?

NYTIMES wrote:

---

When I was in BMOC, I seem to remember we figured out that 12 hour tours would give us less vacation weeks every year. Can anyone confirm this?

---

 
Not necessarily it would turn into Hour and Minute bank versus 27 Days, it would be equivalent having off 5 weeks what I would want to know is how much chart time would be accumulated doing the course of a calendar year.

ItCouldBeWorse wrote:

---

You and the 163 have zero credibility, vast majority voted in favor of that HORRIBLE 2021 contract. That email is just buying him time, 2026 is confirmed, unless city bends.

---

 My delegate never asked for my input on 12 hour tours. Based on my conversations with other sgts in my command the overwhelming majority are in favor or are indifferent to 12 hours tours but would support it if its necessary to pass the contract. So how was this vote a unanimous no ? I imagine its the same in other commands as wellThe delegates are either incompetent or blatantly corrupt. 

EOT63 wrote:

---

ItCouldBeWorse wrote:

---

You and the 163 have zero credibility, vast majority voted in favor of that HORRIBLE 2021 contract. That email is just buying him time, 2026 is confirmed, unless city bends.

---

 My delegate never asked for my input on 12 hour tours. Based on my conversations with other sgts in my command the overwhelming majority are in favor or are indifferent to 12 hours tours but would support it if its necessary to pass the contract. So how was this vote a unanimous no ? I imagine its the same in other commands as wellThe delegates are either incompetent or blatantly corrupt. 

---

 You cant just agree to pass a contract because its necessary or out of emotion. Say no to 12 hour tours. 

TicketoutofNarco wrote:

---

EOT63 wrote:

---

ItCouldBeWorse wrote:

---

You and the 163 have zero credibility, vast majority voted in favor of that HORRIBLE 2021 contract. That email is just buying him time, 2026 is confirmed, unless city bends.

---

 My delegate never asked for my input on 12 hour tours. Based on my conversations with other sgts in my command the overwhelming majority are in favor or are indifferent to 12 hours tours but would support it if its necessary to pass the contract. So how was this vote a unanimous no ? I imagine its the same in other commands as wellThe delegates are either incompetent or blatantly corrupt. 

---

 You cant just agree to pass a contract because its necessary or out of emotion. Say no to 12 hour tours. 

---

 Correct, but the numbers are in, the talking points have been discussed numerous times. The SBA has put its member between a rock and a hard place, so the Lts got a contract first agrees the 12 hour tours in principal but it never was put into place so now the SBA is holding the proverbial bag.

I personally would love to get a retro and make some additions to my home, but I guess the city Collecting interest on my dime is okay also.

-- Edited by No63foryou on Friday 4th of April 2025 11:23:57 PM

EOT63 wrote:

---

ItCouldBeWorse wrote:

---

You and the 163 have zero credibility, vast majority voted in favor of that HORRIBLE 2021 contract. That email is just buying him time, 2026 is confirmed, unless city bends.

---

 My delegate never asked for my input on 12 hour tours. Based on my conversations with other sgts in my command the overwhelming majority are in favor or are indifferent to 12 hours tours but would support it if its necessary to pass the contract. So how was this vote a unanimous no ? I imagine its the same in other commands as wellThe delegates are either incompetent or blatantly corrupt. 

---

Here's an idea:

Have a representative from every command conduct a poll on EVERY Sergeant within that command to see if they want the 12-hour tours. Gather up the results of your command and have an overhead command (example: Sgt at the boro) collect all those results. If every Patrol/Housing/Transit boro did this, you would have a much larger representation within your union.

Rather than having ALL 163 union board members, who don't represent 90% of the actual union.

PD2FD wrote:

---

EOT63 wrote:

---

ItCouldBeWorse wrote:

---

You and the 163 have zero credibility, vast majority voted in favor of that HORRIBLE 2021 contract. That email is just buying him time, 2026 is confirmed, unless city bends.

---

 My delegate never asked for my input on 12 hour tours. Based on my conversations with other sgts in my command the overwhelming majority are in favor or are indifferent to 12 hours tours but would support it if its necessary to pass the contract. So how was this vote a unanimous no ? I imagine its the same in other commands as wellThe delegates are either incompetent or blatantly corrupt. 

---

Here's an idea:

Have a representative from every command conduct a poll on EVERY Sergeant within that command to see if they want the 12-hour tours. Gather up the results of your command and have an overhead command (example: Sgt at the boro) collect all those results. If every Patrol/Housing/Transit boro did this, you would have a much larger representation within your union.

Rather than having ALL 163 union board members, who don't represent 90% of the actual union.

---

 I got a phone call last night from a delegate doing just that. I told him I have no interest in 12 hour tours and I asked him what the consensus was from other sgts he had spoken to. Said a few said yes but most said no 

 Correct, but the numbers are in, the talking points have been discussed numerous times. The SBA has put its member between a rock and a hard place, so the Lts got a contract first agrees the 12 hour tours in principal but it never was put into place so now the SBA is holding the proverbial bag.

I personally would love to get a retro and make some additions to my home, but I guess the city Collecting interest on my dime is okay also.

-- Edited by No63foryou on Friday 4th of April 2025 11:23:57 PM

-- Edited by No63foryou on Friday 4th of April 2025 11:26:18 PM

---

My two cents with the 12 hour tours.

The terms of OLR are vague in the LBAs agreement. It basically says we would agree to participate in 12 hour tours program.

What does that mean, no one knows. The police dept is claiming they want to drop the tours but what if that changes when we sign. We would be at the mercy of the city and this job. No thank you.

10 hour tours I would take in a heartbeat. 12 hour tours work in many other depts where they actually care about their cops morale and general wellbeing. This dept would make 12 hour tours miserable because some chief will come up with some program to reduce crime making you stand on a foot post in transit or time square for 12 hours with no meal and then be back at work with 6 hours between shifts.

Many Chiefs ruin this job and they would ruin 12 hour tours. There are three types of chiefs. One corrupt. Two do not care about cops only care about their next promotion and will do anything to get it. Three the good ones who did not forget they started at the bottom and remember what it was like. Take a guess which type is the smallest group. My favorite is the fat chiefs that are so concerned with professional appearance. Sorry I am not wearing a jacket when it is 60 degrees but at least I do not look like I have been on the Krispy Kreme diet for 30 years

How freely these top payers speak, with no worry in the world, nah i dont want 12s keep your raise im good.

sector7 wrote:

---

 Correct, but the numbers are in, the talking points have been discussed numerous times. The SBA has put its member between a rock and a hard place, so the Lts got a contract first agrees the 12 hour tours in principal but it never was put into place so now the SBA is holding the proverbial bag.

I personally would love to get a retro and make some additions to my home, but I guess the city Collecting interest on my dime is okay also.

-- Edited by No63foryou on Friday 4th of April 2025 11:23:57 PM

-- Edited by No63foryou on Friday 4th of April 2025 11:26:18 PM

---

My two cents with the 12 hour tours.

The terms of OLR are vague in the LBAs agreement. It basically says we would agree to participate in 12 hour tours program.

What does that mean, no one knows. The police dept is claiming they want to drop the tours but what if that changes when we sign. We would be at the mercy of the city and this job. No thank you.

10 hour tours I would take in a heartbeat. 12 hour tours work in many other depts where they actually care about their cops morale and general wellbeing. This dept would make 12 hour tours miserable because some chief will come up with some program to reduce crime making you stand on a foot post in transit or time square for 12 hours with no meal and then be back at work with 6 hours between shifts.

Many Chiefs ruin this job and they would ruin 12 hour tours. There are three types of chiefs. One corrupt. Two do not care about cops only care about their next promotion and will do anything to get it. Three the good ones who did not forget they started at the bottom and remember what it was like. Take a guess which type is the smallest group. My favorite is the fat chiefs that are so concerned with professional appearance. Sorry I am not wearing a jacket when it is 60 degrees but at least I do not look like I have been on the Krispy Kreme diet for 30 years

---

 The 10 hours would be an amazing sweet spot but thats never been on the table, but the city has no desire to make anyones life easier. I agree maybe we should fight the good fight, but if it ends up the SBA bending the knee to the city. Then all this posturing and rhetoric makes the SBA board look like imbeciles and unfit for duty for the office they hold.

No1isbetter wrote:

---

How freely these top payers speak, with no worry in the world, nah i dont want 12s keep your raise im good.

---

 I dont think anyone wants 12s but at what point of a losing battle do you realize youve lost.

SBA is the laughingstock of the NYPD unions.Vinnie and his boys are a bunch of cowards that were never really cops..guys are a bunch of fat pussiesunlike a real supervisor these guys are scared to make a decision so will just keep kicking the can down the road, putting out bullshit emails and buying time

No63foryou wrote:

---

No1isbetter wrote:

---

How freely these top payers speak, with no worry in the world, nah i dont want 12s keep your raise im good.

---

 I dont think anyone wants 12s but at what point of a losing battle do you realize youve lost.

---

 But you make the best of it, with proper staffing, SGTs should only end up working 8/12 hours. Thats 4 hours of free time paid to go work out, sit down eat your meal, take a nap, whatever you feel like doing, its not hard for 3 SGTs to split desk/patrol. Lieutenants shouldnt be excluded, everyone should be doing their part. Not every day will work out or go our way but most days will. 12hr tours should be staffing 1 Lt & 3 SGTs at the very least. correct me if Im wrong but contractually LTs should have 2 staffed on each tour.

In theory the 12hr tours are great, youre dismantling 1 platoon and splitting the MOS into one of the 2 remaining tours. So you should have more personnel for each tour. However NYPD has a sexual fetish with MFF, All Out, various other foot posts so it doesnt work the way it was intended. If they scrapped all these nonsense details it would probably work great.

GangGreenMets wrote:

---

In theory the 12hr tours are great, youre dismantling 1 platoon and splitting the MOS into one of the 2 remaining tours. So you should have more personnel for each tour. However NYPD has a sexual fetish with MFF, All Out, various other foot posts so it doesnt work the way it was intended. If they scrapped all these nonsense details it would probably work great.

---

 Agree 100%. Btw huge lol on the sexual fetish line 

GangGreenMets wrote:

---

In theory the 12hr tours are great, youre dismantling 1 platoon and splitting the MOS into one of the 2 remaining tours. So you should have more personnel for each tour. However NYPD has a sexual fetish with MFF, All Out, various other foot posts so it doesnt work the way it was intended. If they scrapped all these nonsense details it would probably work great.

---

 Its not just 2 squads its 630 start and 1800 start, 1900 start. OMAP in all its glory couldnt come up with something better.

That move was just stupid, they over complicated a simple thing.

For sgts it should be 2 tours, 12:30 hours and with that you can do 3 on 4 off and once a month you will have to work a 4th 12:30 hr tour. I believe most guys would go for that, its similar to mtas schedule and it should get you pass the 2088 hrs you are required to work.

Ill be down with 12 hour tours if they do them 12am-12pm For example. You get to avoid traffic and still do errands or spend time with the family. This 6-6 is stupid.

Blame your fkn delegates too. They dont give a fk and this 163-0 is complete bullshit people just wanna keep their gigs. Kick out a vote and let the real fkn sgts out on patrol make a decision. Union is a joke and so are you vinny. Sold out your sgts whove been around for a while. So much for going around saying you want to protect your own and cant worry about the unborn and about those taking a Lt promo right ? Yea some people have heard about that speech you gave. Disgrace. You wanted to be special and not sign like the other unions and now you look like an ass. On the flip side. We cant just be upset at vinny and delegates. We need to look in the mirror and take some fkn accountability ourselves. Coming on a forum like im doing now only does so much. We need to do something about it to make sure this doesnt happen again, and perhaps vote this guy out and the rest of these careless people out somehow. Enough is enough.

TenFour16 wrote:

---

Blame your fkn delegates too. They dont give a fk and this 163-0 is complete bullshit people just wanna keep their gigs. Kick out a vote and let the real fkn sgts out on patrol make a decision. Union is a joke and so are you vinny. Sold out your sgts whove been around for a while. So much for going around saying you want to protect your own and cant worry about the unborn and about those taking a Lt promo right ? Yea some people have heard about that speech you gave. Disgrace. You wanted to be special and not sign like the other unions and now you look like an ass. On the flip side. We cant just be upset at vinny and delegates. We need to look in the mirror and take some fkn accountability ourselves. Coming on a forum like im doing now only does so much. We need to do something about it to make sure this doesnt happen again, and perhaps vote this guy out and the rest of these careless people out somehow. Enough is enough.

---

 To run for SBA president you need to be a delegate for a period of time prior to running against him. 

163-0 is absolutely insane when so many sgts are beyond upset. How are the delegates representative of the membership right now? Absolute clown show.

Take a look at what Ive been saying. The delegates, Directors and Board members are all to blame. I sincerely believe they all cater to Vinny and dont have the audacity to tell him no or that they disagree with him. Its now or never folks. Ive gotten a few messages. A few more are needed.

UncleC69 wrote:

---

Take a look at what Ive been saying. The delegates, Directors and Board members are all to blame. I sincerely believe they all cater to Vinny and dont have the audacity to tell him no or that they disagree with him. Its now or never folks. Ive gotten a few messages. A few more are needed.

---

I may reach out, Im going to skim through this SBA Constitution and by-laws see if anything from the grass roots level can be started up.

At minimum you need two thirds of the delegates present to suspend any article of constitution, theres zero language of failing members or being incompetent, to call for his resignation.

But if that 163-0 vote is any indication is that status quo is just listen to Vinny.

-- Edited by No63foryou on Sunday 6th of April 2025 01:41:58 AM

Where does one go to see the full constitution and by-laws?

These were the latest SBA bylaws and constitution I could find. Attached to my post - hopefully no issues seeing them as attachments. 

I find it to be a major problem that 163 delegates to none voted against 12 hour tours. Clearly none of these delegates truly asked their peers how they felt because somewhere I can assure you there is a precinct that would agree on it. I asked my old delegate why we dont take a vote & he said Vinny said this and Vinny said that. I dont give a fuck what Vinny said. I didn't vote for Vinny and Vinny dont give a fuck about me & told me I should demote myself because he was going to fuck me in the ass with no lube. There was also something I heard that if Vinny put it out for a vote and it went against his decision, the city can force a vote of confidence & he can get booted. So clearly this is all in his best interest, not his union. Never had one issues with Lynch all my years as a cop, but 3 as a Sgt & Vinny is the biggest scumbag Ive ever seen.

Most here know exactly how that 163-0 vote went down. They sat down and the main guy said, "you can vote however you want but we are a union. We have to show solidarity and we have to show strength in numbers." Basically, if you do not vote the way we want, you will be put on notice. This of course nullifies the whole thing. The fact that he mentioned this in that email shows two things. The union thinks their constituents are complete morons that will swallow whatever silly numbers or stats the union throws at them and that they "think" they know what they're doing. None of those things are true. Since my last response, I'm down $450 which I will never ever get back. And it only has been 3 days. I would understand this if the union had strong cards, but they do not. So what's the point really...

Once these assholes go on summer recess like fkn little kids, any contract wouldnt happen until earliest October, which means no raise is coming until 2026. Im trying to buy a fkn house for my family with a kid on the way & these mother fuckers want to keep us poor for fkn 12hr tours. Im baffled that this is the citys only request, no givebacks whatsoever, and its never fkn good enough for these corrupt fucks. So easy for them making Top Pay plus 10% not having to worry about the small loss in overage, or paying gas with their take home car, and all the perks they get. Never felt anything close like this about Lynch. Stalliemails. 

My delegate asked us a few months back and the vote was around 70% no for 12 hour tours

If its a simple yes or no vote on 12 hour tours, nos are sure to win, the implementation in the few commands theyve been rolled out in has been a nightmare. 12 hour tours or no contract, however, is a different vote entirely- one that were not going to be allowed to participate in. And as has been stated, were losing hundreds of dollars a day in the meantime- dollars that people who are about to get fked out of fair back pay cant afford to lose.

WartimeConsigliere wrote:

---

If its a simple yes or no vote on 12 hour tours, nos are sure to win, the implementation in the few commands theyve been rolled out in has been a nightmare. 12 hour tours or no contract, however, is a different vote entirely- one that were not going to be allowed to participate in. And as has been stated, were losing hundreds of dollars a day in the meantime- dollars that people who are about to get fked out of fair back pay cant afford to lose.

---

Its not only the back pay, the value of the dollar today versus the dollar tomorrow or 3 years ago. We are now kissing the ring of the mayor to fight our battle. Lets see how this plays out.

Yep- inflation since 2021 has been approximately 18%. This is not a raise, its a cost of living adjustment.

WartimeConsigliere wrote:

---

Yep- inflation since 2021 has been approximately 18%. This is not a raise, its a cost of living adjustment.

---

 F*** Vinny 

When doing the desk, I just want to be able to occasionally say "yes, get me the......." when my 5+ yotd TS operator orders food and asks me if I want anything.

https://www.police1.com/nypd-sergeants-union-urges-adams-to-kill-12-hour-shifts-in-contract-talks

Was in the Daily News yesterday, most couldnt read it without a subscription

A city spokeswoman said the 12-hour shift proposal at the heart of the issue is a small-scale, one-year pilot program that would affect approximately 50 sergeants.

It is unfortunate, the spokeswoman said, that the Sergeants Benevolent Association continues to hold up raises for 5,000 sergeants, and is trying to negotiate in the press rather than coming to the table to reach an agreement for a good contract that includes a limited pilot program consistent with tours that many police officers are already working as part of a pilot program negotiated with the Police Benevolent Association .

Somebody is fibbing.

But Vinny said they agreed to the 50 Sgt pilot when they signed, so looks like Vinny is a fkn liar as usual.

50Sgt VS 1,200 96k base Sgts. The math aint mathing.